Grieving with Hope. Year Two

[00:00:00] [SPEAKER_01]: In My Head Pops, The Memory of My Dad Taking Me to White Castle When I Was Ten Years Old.

[00:00:05] [SPEAKER_00]: Why? Why is that?

[00:00:07] [SPEAKER_01]: I need to hear about this.

[00:00:08] [SPEAKER_01]: It's the memory, you know, your dad's favorite sandwich and this is how he liked it.

[00:00:13] [SPEAKER_01]: I'd never been to White Castle. I'd never had White Castle and we were living in Columbus, Ohio at the time.

[00:00:17] [SPEAKER_02]: And your father felt compelled to give you gastrointestinal problems.

[00:00:21] [SPEAKER_01]: Thanks, Dad. I still have them to this day.

[00:00:37] [SPEAKER_01]: In the Bible, Colossians chapter one verse seventeen which says,

[00:00:41] [SPEAKER_01]: Christ is before all things and in him all things hold together.

[00:00:46] [SPEAKER_02]: Christ in all things is a listening ear into conversations about receiving and giving the love and hope of Christ.

[00:00:53] [SPEAKER_01]: These conversations are an invitation because as much as you'll hear and as much as we enjoy having them,

[00:00:59] [SPEAKER_01]: digital media operates from a distance and that's not what's best for us with God or with one another.

[00:01:07] [SPEAKER_02]: So, thanks for listening. And if you're in the neighborhood, we invite you to participate in person

[00:01:12] [SPEAKER_02]: in the life that finds its epicenter at St. Paul's Lutheran Church, 210 East Pleasant Street in O'Connor, Wisconsin.

[00:01:31] [SPEAKER_02]: Welcome to Christ in all things.

[00:01:34] [SPEAKER_02]: I am Pastor Lance ODonnell.

[00:01:36] [SPEAKER_02]: I'm Pastor Jason Schockman.

[00:01:37] [SPEAKER_02]: And we're here today to do on grieving part seven.

[00:01:43] [SPEAKER_02]: This is two years out from, well, it's the two years ago you're dead, graduated to the church triumphant.

[00:01:50] [SPEAKER_02]: Indeed. So, I want to begin with prayer.

[00:01:57] [SPEAKER_02]: Amid his tears, O Lord, I praise you that you have received Gary Shackman to yourself in glory for all eternity.

[00:02:06] [SPEAKER_02]: I thank you that you have brought him to the knowledge of Jesus Christ, our Lord and Savior.

[00:02:15] [SPEAKER_02]: Comfort all who mourn, especially Pastor Jason Shackman with the glorious hope of the resurrection and life eternal.

[00:02:23] [SPEAKER_02]: Grant him grace to say with a believing heart, Thy will be done.

[00:02:28] [SPEAKER_02]: And to know that your will is good and a gracious will, even as he mourns.

[00:02:36] [SPEAKER_02]: Comfort him through your gospel, which promises strength and help to the troubled and weary, O Lord, for sake him not in his grief.

[00:02:45] [SPEAKER_02]: Prepare him and all of us through your word and sacrament for that day when you call us to yourself,

[00:02:51] [SPEAKER_02]: that we may joyfully join the whole company of heaven and live with you forever.

[00:02:56] [SPEAKER_02]: In Jesus' name we pray. Amen.

[00:03:00] [SPEAKER_02]: Amen.

[00:03:00] [SPEAKER_02]: So, two years ago today you got the word where you weren't there.

[00:03:05] [SPEAKER_01]: No, in fact I had just come home. I was up visiting and had gone up on a Friday and spent Friday night with mom and dad.

[00:03:17] [SPEAKER_01]: And then I came home Saturday and helped with church and then got home from church and got the phone call from mom.

[00:03:26] [SPEAKER_01]: And so I turned, no. It was not, it was, I forget which day of the week it was at this point.

[00:03:35] [SPEAKER_01]: Either way, I had done church and I immediately turned around and went back up.

[00:03:44] [SPEAKER_01]: I think it was Sunday. I think we had finished church on Sunday and I got the call from mom that dad had died.

[00:03:51] [SPEAKER_01]: And so I just left. I think I called you before I left and said, I'm not helping.

[00:04:01] [SPEAKER_01]: So it must have been, it must have been a Saturday night.

[00:04:09] [SPEAKER_01]: And then I was gone.

[00:04:11] [SPEAKER_01]: No.

[00:04:12] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I don't remember. I remember I missed church.

[00:04:14] [SPEAKER_02]: 18 months ago.

[00:04:15] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[00:04:15] [SPEAKER_02]: You would have been able to tell me all of that. Absolutely.

[00:04:18] [SPEAKER_02]: With some detail.

[00:04:19] [SPEAKER_02]: Absolutely.

[00:04:19] [SPEAKER_02]: Which itself is, it's interesting to me some of the things that you remember.

[00:04:28] [SPEAKER_02]: So caveat.

[00:04:29] [SPEAKER_02]: And some of the things that you don't.

[00:04:30] [SPEAKER_01]: Caviott here.

[00:04:31] [SPEAKER_01]: And my wife would attest to this too is there's a lot I don't remember just in general.

[00:04:37] [SPEAKER_01]: We joke about my brain being Swiss cheese and that stuff falls into holes and other stuff is really solid.

[00:04:43] [SPEAKER_01]: We joke about my brain being like a bank vault where there's really valuable stuff in there, but getting it out is a problem.

[00:04:50] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[00:04:53] [SPEAKER_01]: There's a lot of things in life right that go by me and I just don't remember.

[00:05:02] [SPEAKER_01]: But.

[00:05:03] [SPEAKER_01]: But.

[00:05:04] [SPEAKER_01]: And details are some of those things.

[00:05:07] [SPEAKER_02]: But my guess is there's some details that you what do you remember?

[00:05:11] [SPEAKER_01]: I remember getting the phone call from mom that dad had died and calling you and saying, dad just died.

[00:05:20] [SPEAKER_01]: I'm leaving.

[00:05:22] [SPEAKER_01]: And you just said go.

[00:05:24] [SPEAKER_01]: And then I remember calling Mark Treadray on the way up your best friend, my best friend in the world.

[00:05:30] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[00:05:31] [SPEAKER_01]: And I don't remember the drive up.

[00:05:35] [SPEAKER_01]: I remember seeing the scenery and going over the hills and trying to keep my eyes on the road while I was driving and having some very intense words for the enemy about what he didn't get to do.

[00:05:57] [SPEAKER_01]: That is the devil.

[00:05:58] [SPEAKER_01]: The devil.

[00:05:59] [SPEAKER_01]: All his in all his demons.

[00:06:01] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, about what he didn't get to do.

[00:06:04] [SPEAKER_01]: Kind of like the Michael saying the Lord review queue reminding the enemy that he is defeated and death is not his victory.

[00:06:17] [SPEAKER_01]: And those were pretty loud conversations as you drove alone as I drove alone in your little Subaru heading north toward Elton, Wisconsin and my little Subaru.

[00:06:29] [SPEAKER_01]: Up County Road P or Highway P or whatever it is until I got to.

[00:06:36] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I don't remember going through Oshkosh.

[00:06:40] [SPEAKER_01]: I don't remember.

[00:06:42] [SPEAKER_01]: So yeah, so when I got there, you remember when you got there?

[00:06:45] [SPEAKER_01]: So then I got there and my sister was already there because she lives around the corner.

[00:06:50] [SPEAKER_01]: And I walked in and mom said that she hadn't called the funeral home yet because she wanted me to get there first.

[00:07:01] [SPEAKER_01]: So I came in and I went over to dad, who was already with the Lord and spoke the benediction and blessed his body.

[00:07:25] [SPEAKER_02]: And then we all cried.

[00:07:26] [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[00:07:29] [SPEAKER_02]: So I'm interested.

[00:07:31] [SPEAKER_02]: I had no script for this two years out conversation, which is probably safe kind of kind of the way that we've done.

[00:07:39] [SPEAKER_02]: We've done these.

[00:07:40] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[00:07:40] [SPEAKER_02]: But I'm curious two years out.

[00:07:46] [SPEAKER_02]: Given the way we began this conversation a few minutes ago.

[00:07:50] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[00:07:51] [SPEAKER_02]: What does what you remember specifically and what you don't remember?

[00:07:58] [SPEAKER_02]: What does that teach you about grief in general or does it?

[00:08:02] [SPEAKER_01]: Well, so again for me, there's just a ton of stuff in life.

[00:08:06] [SPEAKER_01]: I don't remember.

[00:08:07] [SPEAKER_01]: And that's part of why as you point out, administration isn't necessarily my gift.

[00:08:13] [SPEAKER_01]: There's just a lot of details that I just don't cling to.

[00:08:18] [SPEAKER_01]: I don't keep track of.

[00:08:22] [SPEAKER_01]: So the thing that I hold on to are the things that keep me focused on the promise that Jesus makes that we'll hear this Sunday,

[00:08:39] [SPEAKER_01]: which will be August 11th, 2024.

[00:08:43] [SPEAKER_01]: As we hear Jesus say, I am the bread of life.

[00:08:46] [SPEAKER_01]: He who comes to me will not hunger.

[00:08:48] [SPEAKER_01]: He who believes in me will not thirst.

[00:08:51] [SPEAKER_01]: He who feeds on my flesh and drinks my blood will never die and I will raise him up on the last day.

[00:09:00] [SPEAKER_01]: That is huge for me as you noted before.

[00:09:07] [SPEAKER_01]: You know, I kind of came to grips with my own mortality pretty early on as a 16 year old.

[00:09:12] [SPEAKER_01]: And at that point for me, the promise of the resurrection and the life of the world to come took center stage in my faith

[00:09:22] [SPEAKER_01]: in kind of in my theological life.

[00:09:26] [SPEAKER_01]: And the theological soap boxes I have all tend to revolve around, yeah, but the resurrection.

[00:09:35] [SPEAKER_01]: Sure.

[00:09:36] [SPEAKER_01]: And so even as even as I look back two years out, the things that I remember vividly are the things that for me,

[00:09:50] [SPEAKER_01]: not just for me, but are the things that draw me further into the promise of the resurrection and that my dad is with the Lord.

[00:10:03] [SPEAKER_01]: He died, but he's not dead.

[00:10:10] [SPEAKER_01]: Right.

[00:10:13] [SPEAKER_01]: And that may for the, you know, for the listener, that might sound like I'm talking out of both sides of my mouth.

[00:10:21] [SPEAKER_01]: So maybe a comment there should be given.

[00:10:27] [SPEAKER_01]: We are created body and soul beings, and we are we are immortal.

[00:10:34] [SPEAKER_01]: We are not meant to die.

[00:10:37] [SPEAKER_01]: That wasn't God's intention in creating us in the first place.

[00:10:41] [SPEAKER_01]: And it's only the wages of sin that have brought death into the world.

[00:10:45] [SPEAKER_01]: And the promise that we have in Christ is that the image of God is restored in us body and soul.

[00:10:56] [SPEAKER_01]: Now, we don't experience the fullness of that at least not until Christ returns and all of creation is made new,

[00:11:03] [SPEAKER_01]: which all of creation is groaning now as in the pain of childbearing waiting for that revelation of the sons of God.

[00:11:13] [SPEAKER_01]: Right.

[00:11:14] [SPEAKER_01]: That is the resurrection of the body and the life of the world to come with that all of creation hangs on that.

[00:11:20] [SPEAKER_01]: And we as Christians are taught by the word to by the word of God to attach ourselves to that which is eternal

[00:11:33] [SPEAKER_01]: and be willing to let go of those things that are temporal all the while within our temporal vocations

[00:11:41] [SPEAKER_01]: are our current earthly callings serving our neighbor with gladness because that's how God serves.

[00:11:48] [SPEAKER_01]: Right.

[00:11:48] [SPEAKER_01]: That's how God works through means and we get to be as means and that's kind of wild.

[00:11:56] [SPEAKER_01]: So dad died.

[00:12:00] [SPEAKER_01]: That's a past event.

[00:12:02] [SPEAKER_01]: But the present circumstances that he is very much alive in Christ and waiting with all the saints that have gone before us,

[00:12:12] [SPEAKER_01]: patiently, eagerly in anticipation of the resurrection of the body and the life of the world to come.

[00:12:19] [SPEAKER_01]: Revelation paints it is how long though Lord until you avenge our blood right that is this blood that speaks a better word than able

[00:12:27] [SPEAKER_01]: it doesn't cry out for vengeance that cries out for forgiveness and renewal in life this blood of Jesus.

[00:12:33] [SPEAKER_01]: And that's what we're united with even temporarily here in the Lord's supper.

[00:12:37] [SPEAKER_01]: Wow.

[00:12:37] [SPEAKER_01]: This just got really deep theologically.

[00:12:39] [SPEAKER_01]: Indeed.

[00:12:41] [SPEAKER_01]: And I kind of live in that space right?

[00:12:44] [SPEAKER_01]: So for me the things that I hold on to are those things that point me to Christ and that hope that is sure and certain

[00:12:58] [SPEAKER_01]: and waiting for me when Christ returns.

[00:13:01] [SPEAKER_02]: Do you find your mom when you talk to your mom, when you talk to your sister, do you find yourself talking about dad now and then?

[00:13:10] [SPEAKER_01]: With with with Sean, my sister more than with mom.

[00:13:17] [SPEAKER_01]: Just because mom has known grief and death since a very early age in her own life as well.

[00:13:26] [SPEAKER_01]: Her mother died when she was a teenager and mom kind of took over running the house and she and her twin sister

[00:13:34] [SPEAKER_01]: and her older sister really were all at different points in life.

[00:13:36] [SPEAKER_01]: And so mom very much knows what it means to just go on and doesn't dwell on the sadness of loss.

[00:13:52] [SPEAKER_01]: Doesn't really like to talk about the sadness of loss because then she gets misty and cries and she doesn't like that.

[00:13:58] [SPEAKER_01]: And that makes her uncomfortable.

[00:13:59] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, that makes her uncomfortable.

[00:14:00] [SPEAKER_01]: It makes a lot of people uncomfortable.

[00:14:03] [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, let's be honest, right?

[00:14:03] [SPEAKER_01]: And part of it makes her uncomfortable though because of the certainty she has in Christ and his resurrection promise

[00:14:13] [SPEAKER_01]: and the joy that we have in knowing there's nothing that can shake what Christ gives us.

[00:14:21] [SPEAKER_01]: So as we look forward to this school year, 2024, 2025 school year.

[00:14:26] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, we're recording this on the eighth day of August in the year of our Lord, 2024.

[00:14:31] [SPEAKER_02]: Right.

[00:14:32] [SPEAKER_01]: Our theme from Romans five to is we rejoice in the hope of the glory of God.

[00:14:41] [SPEAKER_01]: And specifically that hope of the glory of God is the resurrection.

[00:14:46] [SPEAKER_01]: And there's nothing in this temporary world that can change that promise.

[00:14:56] [SPEAKER_01]: And both my mom and I and my sister rejoice in that.

[00:15:03] [SPEAKER_01]: And we cling to it so we don't spend a lot of time talking about what dad used to be because he is.

[00:15:15] [SPEAKER_01]: Got it.

[00:15:15] [SPEAKER_01]: If that makes sense.

[00:15:16] [SPEAKER_01]: So he does.

[00:15:17] [SPEAKER_02]: He died, but he's not dead.

[00:15:21] [SPEAKER_02]: It's interesting to me talking to you about this because I am right now in the midst of a conversation with my sister,

[00:15:30] [SPEAKER_02]: who was just 18 when my father died.

[00:15:34] [SPEAKER_02]: And she and her boyfriend were back visiting.

[00:15:38] [SPEAKER_02]: They live in California or back visiting their childhood haunts for him in northern Michigan

[00:15:44] [SPEAKER_02]: and my sister in our old hometown of Frankinmouth, Michigan.

[00:15:48] [SPEAKER_02]: So they just made a stop and went to some and I just got a picture a couple hours ago.

[00:15:56] [SPEAKER_02]: There was this place in there was a little Italian diner in Saginaw that got that guy financed my dad's first car.

[00:16:07] [SPEAKER_02]: And they had an affiliate restaurant not far from where we lived in Frankinmouth.

[00:16:12] [SPEAKER_02]: And we would go occasionally and we had a dad would get a particular kind of sandwich the way he liked it.

[00:16:17] [SPEAKER_02]: When he cooked it back in the day.

[00:16:20] [SPEAKER_02]: And it's fun.

[00:16:22] [SPEAKER_02]: Remember remembering those things and what was it that dad?

[00:16:26] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, he always got it.

[00:16:28] [SPEAKER_02]: He got it.

[00:16:28] [SPEAKER_02]: The giant steak and cheese with mushrooms on end to make because he liked the end of the loaf.

[00:16:35] [SPEAKER_02]: He liked the heel?

[00:16:37] [SPEAKER_02]: Absolutely.

[00:16:37] [SPEAKER_02]: I picked that up.

[00:16:39] [SPEAKER_02]: But it's interesting those type of things.

[00:16:43] [SPEAKER_02]: And that's I can tell from, we talked on the phone yesterday for a while.

[00:16:50] [SPEAKER_02]: I can tell from her tone of voice what a great joy it is for her to remember some of those things.

[00:16:58] [SPEAKER_02]: Oh yeah, this is where we used to go when we'd go to currant sausages and we'd get here and dad would take me here and sharing that with her boyfriend.

[00:17:06] [SPEAKER_02]: And he'd do that for her as they get, you know, that's sometimes those things are life giving.

[00:17:13] [SPEAKER_01]: Well, I mean, even as you're saying that right into my head pops the memory of my dad taking me to White Castle when I was 10 years old.

[00:17:21] [SPEAKER_00]: Why?

[00:17:22] [SPEAKER_00]: Why is that?

[00:17:23] [SPEAKER_01]: I need to hear about this.

[00:17:25] [SPEAKER_01]: It's the memory.

[00:17:26] [SPEAKER_01]: It's your dad's favorite sandwich and this is how he liked it.

[00:17:29] [SPEAKER_01]: And I had never been to White Castle.

[00:17:31] [SPEAKER_01]: I'd never had White Castle and we were living in Columbus, Ohio at the time.

[00:17:34] [SPEAKER_02]: And your father felt compelled to give you gastrointestinal problems.

[00:17:37] [SPEAKER_01]: Thanks dad, I still have them to this day.

[00:17:41] [SPEAKER_01]: And, you know, he said, Jason, let's go get White Castle.

[00:17:44] [SPEAKER_01]: I'm like, White Castle?

[00:17:45] [SPEAKER_01]: What's White Castle?

[00:17:47] [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, and he went, did he get a smile on his face?

[00:17:50] [SPEAKER_01]: Oh yeah.

[00:17:51] [SPEAKER_01]: And he goes, let's go get White Castle.

[00:17:53] [SPEAKER_01]: So we went and got steamed mini burgers from White Cast because they don't grill them.

[00:17:58] [SPEAKER_01]: They steam them.

[00:17:59] [SPEAKER_01]: Steamed meat hamburger mini burgers.

[00:18:02] [SPEAKER_01]: You know, a little square patty with five holes in it so they can sell you less meat in that little square.

[00:18:10] [SPEAKER_01]: And yeah.

[00:18:11] [SPEAKER_01]: So we had White Castle and Onion Rings.

[00:18:15] [SPEAKER_01]: And you were 10?

[00:18:16] [SPEAKER_01]: I was about 10.

[00:18:18] [SPEAKER_01]: I don't remember if I was nine or 10.

[00:18:20] [SPEAKER_02]: But you remember that you had White Castle?

[00:18:22] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, we had Onion Rings.

[00:18:23] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, we were in Columbus.

[00:18:25] [SPEAKER_01]: Dad was working for Ma Belle at the time, Ohio Belle.

[00:18:28] [SPEAKER_02]: This is so interesting to me.

[00:18:30] [SPEAKER_02]: You can't remember on the day your dad died, what day it was,

[00:18:35] [SPEAKER_02]: what exactly was going on surrounding.

[00:18:40] [SPEAKER_02]: But I mean, you remember when you arrived and blessing his body.

[00:18:45] [SPEAKER_02]: You remember greeting your mom and you remember a bunch of host of other things.

[00:18:51] [SPEAKER_02]: You remember that you had Onion Rings with your White Castle when you were 10 with your dad.

[00:18:57] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[00:18:58] [SPEAKER_02]: It's funny.

[00:18:59] [SPEAKER_01]: The things that we remember and that we don't.

[00:19:02] [SPEAKER_01]: Well, I mean, there's a lot of things I remember about life with dad, right?

[00:19:07] [SPEAKER_01]: Sure.

[00:19:08] [SPEAKER_01]: Some good, some bad.

[00:19:09] [SPEAKER_01]: Of course.

[00:19:09] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, you had a complicated as we say relationship with your father.

[00:19:13] [SPEAKER_01]: My dad was really good at being an authority figure when I was little, little.

[00:19:17] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[00:19:18] [SPEAKER_01]: He didn't transition so well to the coach figure that I needed as I came into my teenage years.

[00:19:24] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[00:19:25] [SPEAKER_01]: Right.

[00:19:27] [SPEAKER_01]: Whenever the birds and the bees talk would come up with my dad, he would say, go talk to your mother.

[00:19:31] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[00:19:32] [SPEAKER_01]: And then finally when I got engaged, like I'm 19 and I'm engaged and my dad and I were driving,

[00:19:40] [SPEAKER_01]: I think from the Twin Cities where my sister lived, we were on our way back to Chicago.

[00:19:44] [SPEAKER_01]: Just my dad and I in this little 1997 Saturn SL stick shift.

[00:19:50] [SPEAKER_01]: I paid for two options on that car, a mirror on the passenger side and air conditioning.

[00:19:59] [SPEAKER_01]: It came with cruise control.

[00:20:00] [SPEAKER_01]: So that was good.

[00:20:01] [SPEAKER_01]: So you had that going?

[00:20:01] [SPEAKER_01]: I had that going for me.

[00:20:04] [SPEAKER_01]: So here my dad and I are driving down the road and all of a sudden he goes, so well,

[00:20:11] [SPEAKER_01]: Jase, you're engaged now.

[00:20:13] [SPEAKER_01]: So there's some things you should probably know.

[00:20:15] [SPEAKER_01]: And he became an unwanted fountain of knowledge about male and female relationships on that

[00:20:24] [SPEAKER_01]: drive.

[00:20:25] [SPEAKER_01]: And about an hour into him, I was first shocked that dad was actually having this conversation.

[00:20:33] [SPEAKER_01]: Second, mortified that my dad thought I had no knowledge of these things.

[00:20:38] [SPEAKER_01]: And about an hour in, I stopped him.

[00:20:41] [SPEAKER_01]: I literally pulled off the freeway, pulled into a gas station, stopped, turned and faced him

[00:20:47] [SPEAKER_01]: and said, dad, I'm 19 and I'm engaged to be married or 20 years old and I'm engaged to be married.

[00:20:56] [SPEAKER_01]: I needed this conversation when I was 10 or 12 because by 13, I had figured most of this out from my friends

[00:21:05] [SPEAKER_01]: or by myself.

[00:21:08] [SPEAKER_01]: This had been really good conversation 10 years ago.

[00:21:11] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[00:21:12] [SPEAKER_01]: And he looked at me and went, no, maybe when you were 16, which made me laugh.

[00:21:21] [SPEAKER_01]: Believe me, dad.

[00:21:23] [SPEAKER_01]: No, right?

[00:21:27] [SPEAKER_01]: And I think then he looked at me a little shocked and a bit mortified.

[00:21:32] [SPEAKER_01]: And then I said, so let's drive, drive back to school.

[00:21:35] [SPEAKER_01]: Okay.

[00:21:35] [SPEAKER_01]: So we got, we got back on the road and drove back to school.

[00:21:42] [SPEAKER_01]: And most of the way was pretty quiet other than the radio talk shows that he was listening to as I drove down the road.

[00:21:49] [SPEAKER_01]: Okay.

[00:21:49] [SPEAKER_01]: So like, I remember a lot of things, right?

[00:21:53] [SPEAKER_01]: So dad was great at being an encourager when he was in that authority figure role.

[00:22:00] [SPEAKER_01]: You know, when I was 10 and trying to learn how to throw a curveball, he was pretty helpful.

[00:22:04] [SPEAKER_01]: And the first time I actually got a ball to break and it broke about a foot and a half.

[00:22:10] [SPEAKER_01]: He, he caught it and then stood up and looked at me like I was a completely different man.

[00:22:18] [SPEAKER_02]: Jason can throw a curveball.

[00:22:19] [SPEAKER_01]: Well, I could then.

[00:22:21] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[00:22:21] [SPEAKER_01]: And then I quit playing baseball because I just, I didn't love it.

[00:22:25] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[00:22:26] [SPEAKER_01]: It was, it was boring.

[00:22:28] [SPEAKER_02]: Was that, was that a grief to him?

[00:22:32] [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know.

[00:22:33] [SPEAKER_01]: Was he a baseball guy?

[00:22:33] [SPEAKER_01]: No.

[00:22:34] [SPEAKER_01]: No?

[00:22:35] [SPEAKER_00]: Okay.

[00:22:39] [SPEAKER_01]: No, I mean we, we'd play running bases like pickle, you know where you'd set up two bases and you'd have one thrower on one base and one thrower on another base and then a runner in between and you're just basically trying to pick people off, right?

[00:22:52] [SPEAKER_01]: Not like ding them.

[00:22:55] [SPEAKER_01]: Right.

[00:22:55] [SPEAKER_01]: But tag them.

[00:22:56] [SPEAKER_01]: Pickle.

[00:22:57] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[00:22:57] [SPEAKER_01]: Pickle.

[00:22:58] [SPEAKER_01]: So we played that in the backyard growing up all the time.

[00:23:00] [SPEAKER_01]: Who'd you stick in the middle?

[00:23:01] [SPEAKER_01]: Well, whoever was sometimes me, I'd start there.

[00:23:06] [SPEAKER_01]: Like if it was my sister and me and my dad, one of us kids would start in the middle.

[00:23:12] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[00:23:12] [SPEAKER_01]: But we'd start on base.

[00:23:14] [SPEAKER_01]: Sure.

[00:23:15] [SPEAKER_01]: Right.

[00:23:15] [SPEAKER_01]: And then sometimes my dad would, my dad's friend Steve would come over, Steven Wastrik.

[00:23:21] [SPEAKER_01]: He was the baseball guy.

[00:23:23] [SPEAKER_01]: Got it.

[00:23:23] [SPEAKER_01]: He was a Cleveland Indians yahoo, wahoo.

[00:23:27] [SPEAKER_01]: Wahoo.

[00:23:28] [SPEAKER_01]: You know, he was a yahoo, wahoo for sure.

[00:23:30] [SPEAKER_01]: He was also, Steven Wastrik is the reason I'm a Cleveland Browns fan.

[00:23:35] [SPEAKER_01]: Okay.

[00:23:35] [SPEAKER_01]: He was a huge Cleveland Browns fan and we spent a lot of time with them and my dad was kind

[00:23:40] [SPEAKER_01]: of like about football but he liked watching it.

[00:23:45] [SPEAKER_01]: He just didn't necessarily have an invested team but Wastrik did and so I became a Cleveland

[00:23:51] [SPEAKER_01]: Browns fan thanks to Steven Wastrik and I.

[00:23:54] [SPEAKER_02]: So Mr. Wastrik, congratulations for bearing, for loading the cross upon your young friend.

[00:23:59] [SPEAKER_02]: Yes.

[00:23:59] [SPEAKER_02]: Jason Chuck.

[00:24:00] [SPEAKER_02]: And now my son bears the same load.

[00:24:03] [SPEAKER_01]: Thanks be to God.

[00:24:06] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[00:24:07] [SPEAKER_01]: So like he would come over and my dad and Mr. Wastrik would stand on the bases and throw

[00:24:11] [SPEAKER_01]: the ball and I would run between them but then if one of them tagged me, we switched.

[00:24:18] [SPEAKER_01]: So if my dad tagged me, my dad was now the base runner and Mr. Wastrik and I would

[00:24:23] [SPEAKER_01]: throw the ball back and forth and wait for dad to run.

[00:24:25] [SPEAKER_01]: Sure.

[00:24:25] [SPEAKER_01]: Because you know, he, yeah.

[00:24:27] [SPEAKER_01]: He was game.

[00:24:29] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, right?

[00:24:31] [SPEAKER_01]: I remember my dad being trying to be a runner and he would go out and go for runs which

[00:24:41] [SPEAKER_01]: were slogging and sweaty and monotonous and he would come home and complain about hurting

[00:24:48] [SPEAKER_01]: because he was running but then he would do it again.

[00:24:51] [SPEAKER_01]: Right?

[00:24:51] [SPEAKER_01]: And I remember my dad instituting a Saturday morning bike ride.

[00:24:58] [SPEAKER_01]: So we lived just off campus.

[00:25:03] [SPEAKER_01]: Instituting.

[00:25:04] [SPEAKER_01]: Okay, yeah, this is great.

[00:25:06] [SPEAKER_01]: So we lived at the time, we lived just outside of Columbus, Ohio right off campus although

[00:25:12] [SPEAKER_01]: saying you're right off the OSU campus is not really geographically limiting.

[00:25:18] [SPEAKER_01]: So we lived in a huge apartment condominium condo complex called the Olin Tangi Commons

[00:25:25] [SPEAKER_01]: right off the Olin Tangi River and there was bike trails that left the commons and joined

[00:25:32] [SPEAKER_01]: up with the bike trails that went all over the OSU campus.

[00:25:36] [SPEAKER_01]: And so we would get on the bike trail and we would ride to the edge of campus where

[00:25:40] [SPEAKER_01]: there was a McDonald's and we would get a McDonald's ice cream cone and then we

[00:25:44] [SPEAKER_01]: would ride home.

[00:25:45] [SPEAKER_01]: And we started doing that.

[00:25:47] [SPEAKER_01]: That's a nice ride.

[00:25:48] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, it was.

[00:25:48] [SPEAKER_01]: It was a 14 mile round trip, 7 and a half miles in.

[00:25:54] [SPEAKER_02]: And did you get to ride your bike by OSU girls as you were driving?

[00:25:58] [SPEAKER_01]: I was 9 or 10.

[00:26:03] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, that's a different conversation.

[00:26:06] [SPEAKER_01]: That's a different conversation.

[00:26:07] [SPEAKER_01]: You and I should have some other time with not microphones.

[00:26:14] [SPEAKER_01]: Anyway, yeah.

[00:26:15] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, you and I should probably have that conversation.

[00:26:20] [SPEAKER_02]: Hey, Jason, let's go for a bike ride and get you an ice cream so I can go see some college girls.

[00:26:26] [SPEAKER_01]: But it wasn't just me.

[00:26:28] [SPEAKER_01]: It was dad and mom and Sean and I and the whole family would go.

[00:26:31] [SPEAKER_02]: A family bike ride.

[00:26:32] [SPEAKER_02]: Right?

[00:26:33] [SPEAKER_01]: And so yeah, it was a Saturday morning instituted bike ride and so we would go.

[00:26:37] [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[00:26:38] [SPEAKER_01]: And of course everyone else in the family was riding a bike that had gears and I was riding

[00:26:45] [SPEAKER_01]: my BMX 20 inch wheels.

[00:26:49] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, barely keeping up your pump and yet I'm the one taking all the little like diversions

[00:26:56] [SPEAKER_01]: off the paved trail that go that go over the little mountains and little jumps.

[00:27:01] [SPEAKER_02]: Absolutely.

[00:27:02] [SPEAKER_00]: Off flying.

[00:27:03] [SPEAKER_01]: Loving it.

[00:27:04] [SPEAKER_01]: Having a great time.

[00:27:07] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[00:27:08] [SPEAKER_01]: And so like I remember doing that.

[00:27:11] [SPEAKER_01]: There's, there's, I remember dad driving me all over the place to soccer and mom too.

[00:27:17] [SPEAKER_01]: But that was a family fun thing.

[00:27:19] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[00:27:19] [SPEAKER_01]: I played four seasons a year when we lived in Columbus.

[00:27:21] [SPEAKER_01]: It was ridiculous.

[00:27:22] [SPEAKER_01]: That is kind of ridiculous.

[00:27:23] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[00:27:23] [SPEAKER_01]: As a third, fourth, fifth grader.

[00:27:25] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[00:27:25] [SPEAKER_01]: That's way too much.

[00:27:27] [SPEAKER_01]: And that was.

[00:27:28] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[00:27:29] [SPEAKER_01]: Quite a while ago.

[00:27:30] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[00:27:30] [SPEAKER_01]: Columbus is a soccer town always has been.

[00:27:32] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[00:27:32] [SPEAKER_01]: So if you're into it and you want to be into it, it's there.

[00:27:37] [SPEAKER_01]: It's there.

[00:27:39] [SPEAKER_01]: So like I remember a lot of things about life and family and how dad really did care

[00:27:46] [SPEAKER_01]: for us and he loved us and he provided for us and we were very thankful and he was

[00:27:53] [SPEAKER_01]: keen to make sure that we grew up in the faith.

[00:27:56] [SPEAKER_03]: Mm hmm.

[00:27:57] [SPEAKER_01]: And, and that was, I'm really thankful for that.

[00:28:03] [SPEAKER_01]: But, but like I mentioned when it got to that, like those, those preteen and teenage years

[00:28:07] [SPEAKER_02]: when I needed more of like an advisor and a coach.

[00:28:10] [SPEAKER_02]: So this is one of those I'm trying to learn wisdom from something my father didn't do

[00:28:15] [SPEAKER_02]: so well.

[00:28:15] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[00:28:16] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[00:28:17] [SPEAKER_02]: And which is what any decent dad should actually want us to do.

[00:28:21] [SPEAKER_01]: And to be completely fair to my dad.

[00:28:23] [SPEAKER_01]: He was way better dad to me than his dad was to him.

[00:28:28] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[00:28:28] [SPEAKER_01]: So, so thanks dad for learning from your dad.

[00:28:31] [SPEAKER_01]: Absolutely.

[00:28:32] [SPEAKER_01]: And, and I really appreciate like all those gifts that God gave us as a family together.

[00:28:41] [SPEAKER_01]: What do what, what, what do I remember?

[00:28:44] [SPEAKER_01]: Well, you just talked about a bunch of things.

[00:28:46] [SPEAKER_01]: There's a ton.

[00:28:47] [SPEAKER_01]: There's a ton of things that I remember.

[00:28:49] [SPEAKER_01]: What do I remember about the actual day that he died?

[00:28:52] [SPEAKER_01]: The important things.

[00:28:53] [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[00:28:55] [SPEAKER_01]: The important things.

[00:28:57] [SPEAKER_01]: Right.

[00:28:58] [SPEAKER_01]: I remember two days before he died being up there and spending the night with mom,

[00:29:04] [SPEAKER_01]: barely sleeping at all, either of us praying with with dad before I left

[00:29:12] [SPEAKER_01]: and given him the benediction before I left.

[00:29:15] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[00:29:17] [SPEAKER_02]: And you, and you knew because of your service as a pastor is being a pastor is all kinds

[00:29:26] [SPEAKER_02]: of troubles and trials and difficulties.

[00:29:29] [SPEAKER_02]: It does.

[00:29:31] [SPEAKER_02]: And there are, there are also some marvelous things.

[00:29:34] [SPEAKER_02]: You, my guess is you also knew because of your service as a pastor what a gift

[00:29:40] [SPEAKER_02]: it was for you to be able to be there.

[00:29:42] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[00:29:43] [SPEAKER_02]: That's a big deal.

[00:29:44] [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[00:29:46] [SPEAKER_01]: Yep.

[00:29:47] [SPEAKER_01]: So it was, it was really good to be able to spend the night with mom before that.

[00:29:55] [SPEAKER_01]: And yeah.

[00:30:00] [SPEAKER_02]: So two years out today.

[00:30:02] [SPEAKER_02]: Yep.

[00:30:03] [SPEAKER_02]: Are you in the journey of grief as it were?

[00:30:06] [SPEAKER_02]: Are you where you thought you would be?

[00:30:09] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[00:30:12] [SPEAKER_01]: So where am I in that journey?

[00:30:15] [SPEAKER_01]: I'm thankful.

[00:30:16] [SPEAKER_01]: Yep.

[00:30:17] [SPEAKER_01]: That God keeps his promises.

[00:30:20] [SPEAKER_01]: There are still moments, especially in and we talked about this a bit.

[00:30:27] [SPEAKER_01]: There's still moments, especially in music that I get a little, I get a little choked

[00:30:33] [SPEAKER_01]: up.

[00:30:37] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[00:30:39] [SPEAKER_01]: We just, in fact, just not what two weeks ago now, two weeks ago, 28.

[00:30:50] [SPEAKER_01]: We celebrated 159 years as a congregation with a big church picnic at the end of July.

[00:31:00] [SPEAKER_01]: And I got to be a church musician that day.

[00:31:06] [SPEAKER_01]: So we played some really fun stuff for church and the closing hymn was...

[00:31:17] [SPEAKER_02]: Now you're jogging my memory.

[00:31:19] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[00:31:20] [SPEAKER_01]: It was, on Christ the solid rock I stand all other ground is sinking.

[00:31:25] [SPEAKER_01]: That's right.

[00:31:28] The...

[00:31:29] [SPEAKER_01]: What I hope is built on nothing less.

[00:31:32] [SPEAKER_01]: I couldn't come up with the first one.

[00:31:33] [SPEAKER_02]: It's the name of the hymn.

[00:31:33] [SPEAKER_02]: I can't remember the number and the service book up, but yeah, my hope is built on nothing less.

[00:31:38] [SPEAKER_01]: So that was our closing hymn.

[00:31:40] [SPEAKER_01]: And we had practiced it.

[00:31:44] [SPEAKER_01]: Mr. Hellwig and Ms. Mackie and myself had practiced this beforehand and days beforehand.

[00:31:52] [SPEAKER_01]: And then that morning we had practiced it again.

[00:31:55] [SPEAKER_01]: And I was fine.

[00:31:57] [SPEAKER_01]: I was...

[00:31:58] [SPEAKER_01]: We're good.

[00:31:59] [SPEAKER_01]: Let's go.

[00:32:00] [SPEAKER_01]: And the third verse...

[00:32:04] [SPEAKER_01]: The third verse gets me just about every time and it hadn't in our practice.

[00:32:07] [SPEAKER_01]: And I was like, okay, maybe I'm good.

[00:32:09] [SPEAKER_02]: Interest.

[00:32:10] [SPEAKER_01]: Maybe I can sing this one again.

[00:32:12] [SPEAKER_01]: And then with the whole congregation singing along.

[00:32:17] [SPEAKER_02]: I don't know it off the top of my head.

[00:32:18] [SPEAKER_01]: What's the third verse?

[00:32:22] [SPEAKER_01]: When every earthly prop gives way, he then is all my hope and stay.

[00:32:28] [SPEAKER_01]: On Christ the solid rock I stand.

[00:32:32] [SPEAKER_01]: All other ground is sinking sand.

[00:32:34] [SPEAKER_01]: So when darkness veils his lovely face, I rest on his unchanging grace.

[00:32:42] [SPEAKER_01]: Through every high and stormy gale my anchor holds within the veil.

[00:32:46] [SPEAKER_01]: On Christ the solid rock I stand.

[00:32:48] [SPEAKER_01]: What is the third verse?

[00:32:51] [SPEAKER_01]: It's the third verse and it's when every earthly prop gives way that gets it.

[00:33:01] [SPEAKER_01]: That is just the one...

[00:33:04] [SPEAKER_01]: That's one of the ones that really sinks me, if you will.

[00:33:11] [SPEAKER_01]: Sinks you.

[00:33:12] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, sinks me.

[00:33:13] [SPEAKER_01]: Because I just stop.

[00:33:16] [SPEAKER_01]: I really can't help it.

[00:33:19] [SPEAKER_01]: I just stop.

[00:33:21] [SPEAKER_01]: Well, and it's Oath.

[00:33:22] [SPEAKER_01]: That's what it is.

[00:33:23] [SPEAKER_01]: It's his oath.

[00:33:25] [SPEAKER_01]: His...the third verse.

[00:33:26] [SPEAKER_01]: His oath, his covenant and blood.

[00:33:30] [SPEAKER_01]: So God's promise, his...

[00:33:34] [SPEAKER_01]: His promise with a blessing, his covenant and his blood.

[00:33:39] [SPEAKER_01]: His shed blood on the cross.

[00:33:41] [SPEAKER_01]: His oath, his covenant, his blood.

[00:33:44] [SPEAKER_01]: Support me in the raging flood.

[00:33:48] [SPEAKER_01]: Think Noah's flood, right?

[00:33:51] [SPEAKER_01]: Okay, that's some baptismal language too.

[00:33:54] [SPEAKER_01]: When every earthly prop gives way, he then is all my hope and stay.

[00:33:58] [SPEAKER_01]: I watched for five years, I watched every earthly prop leave my dad.

[00:34:08] [SPEAKER_01]: I watched his language skills go away.

[00:34:13] [SPEAKER_01]: I watched his ability to articulate what he wanted to say.

[00:34:19] [SPEAKER_01]: Go away.

[00:34:20] [SPEAKER_01]: This is a guy who, after he retired, became a preacher.

[00:34:26] [SPEAKER_01]: Okay?

[00:34:27] [SPEAKER_01]: This is the guy I preached at his ordination.

[00:34:32] [SPEAKER_01]: Words and talking about Jesus was really important to him.

[00:34:36] [SPEAKER_01]: And all of a sudden words went away.

[00:34:38] [SPEAKER_01]: And he couldn't come up with them and that frustrated him.

[00:34:44] [SPEAKER_01]: But he didn't react to it the way that I had all...the way that I thought he would.

[00:34:48] [SPEAKER_01]: He didn't get angry, he didn't get frustrated or cantankerous.

[00:34:53] [SPEAKER_01]: He got quiet, but not melancholy.

[00:35:00] [SPEAKER_01]: What was that?

[00:35:04] [SPEAKER_01]: I think he was trusting in what he knew.

[00:35:07] [SPEAKER_01]: That's a pretty good lesson.

[00:35:09] [SPEAKER_01]: When every earthly prop gives way, he then is all my hope and stay.

[00:35:14] [SPEAKER_01]: So here we are at the church.

[00:35:15] [SPEAKER_01]: The One Service Sunday huge church picnic and Allison's at the piano and I'm playing the guitar

[00:35:23] [SPEAKER_01]: and Brett's singing away and we're singing his oath, his covenant and blood.

[00:35:28] [SPEAKER_01]: And we had practiced that as we get to the support me in the raging flood,

[00:35:33] [SPEAKER_01]: that flood would be the last chord from the instruments.

[00:35:37] [SPEAKER_01]: So just the voices would carry us through when every earthly prop gives way.

[00:35:45] [SPEAKER_01]: He then is all my hope and stay.

[00:35:47] [SPEAKER_01]: I just couldn't sing.

[00:35:49] [SPEAKER_02]: And the congregation sang and carried it all.

[00:35:53] [SPEAKER_02]: And this is, you know, we talked about on the way, this is obviously one of your things.

[00:35:58] [SPEAKER_02]: Music is your...

[00:36:01] [SPEAKER_02]: What's formed me?

[00:36:02] [SPEAKER_02]: What's formed you in, you know...

[00:36:05] [SPEAKER_01]: And even now sitting here at the table thinking that through and remembering that

[00:36:09] [SPEAKER_01]: and remembering the feel of it.

[00:36:12] [SPEAKER_01]: I'm getting a little teary-eyed.

[00:36:13] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, right.

[00:36:14] [SPEAKER_01]: Because that's huge.

[00:36:18] [SPEAKER_01]: We are not alone.

[00:36:21] [SPEAKER_01]: We are carried along by the same spirit that unites the church.

[00:36:27] [SPEAKER_01]: And that's the church throughout time.

[00:36:31] [SPEAKER_01]: Which means my dad's singing that song too.

[00:36:37] [SPEAKER_01]: Man, you know when I talk about those moments where like the song of the church just carries you because you can't?

[00:36:45] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[00:36:46] [SPEAKER_01]: Lord, then at last, thine angels come to Abrams.

[00:36:49] [SPEAKER_01]: Suppose I'm bare me home that I may die unfearing.

[00:36:52] [SPEAKER_01]: And in its narrow chamber keep...

[00:36:54] [SPEAKER_01]: Now think about a little coffin right?

[00:36:55] [SPEAKER_01]: Narrow chamber.

[00:36:56] [SPEAKER_01]: In its narrow chamber keep my body still in peaceful sleep until I reappearing.

[00:37:02] [SPEAKER_01]: And then from death awaken me.

[00:37:05] [SPEAKER_01]: But these mine eyes with joy may see, oh son of God thy glorious face,

[00:37:09] [SPEAKER_01]: my savior and my font of grace.

[00:37:12] [SPEAKER_01]: The songs like that that we sing together as church,

[00:37:19] [SPEAKER_01]: they teach the faith and they carry you along in the faith if you let them.

[00:37:26] [SPEAKER_01]: So yeah, there's still moments in the life of the church which is our life together where I get lost in the music

[00:37:38] [SPEAKER_01]: and I just stop and I let the church carry me because I can't.

[00:37:44] [SPEAKER_01]: And that's okay.

[00:37:46] [SPEAKER_02]: And that is by God's design.

[00:37:50] [SPEAKER_01]: And what a gift right?

[00:37:52] [SPEAKER_01]: They're less frequent two years out than they were a month out.

[00:38:05] [SPEAKER_01]: And I don't think that...

[00:38:07] [SPEAKER_02]: And that's what you expected?

[00:38:08] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[00:38:08] [SPEAKER_01]: And I don't think those, but to be fair, even before dad died,

[00:38:15] [SPEAKER_01]: I'd have those moments in songs.

[00:38:17] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, because music is sure...

[00:38:19] [SPEAKER_01]: It's part of where I run.

[00:38:21] [SPEAKER_01]: It's part of my solace.

[00:38:22] [SPEAKER_01]: It's part of what's formed me into who I am.

[00:38:24] [SPEAKER_01]: And that's a really...

[00:38:27] [SPEAKER_01]: It's a place where I can be really vulnerable.

[00:38:32] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[00:38:33] [SPEAKER_01]: And that's fun to be able to...

[00:38:38] [SPEAKER_01]: It's fun to be able to share that with people?

[00:38:40] [SPEAKER_01]: Absolutely.

[00:38:41] [SPEAKER_01]: That vulnerability, that joy that we share.

[00:38:47] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[00:38:48] [SPEAKER_01]: So that's part of why singing inquires has always been a great thing for me.

[00:38:53] [SPEAKER_01]: It's part of why I love that we're a singing church.

[00:38:57] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[00:38:57] [SPEAKER_01]: Right?

[00:38:58] [SPEAKER_01]: It's a great thing.

[00:38:59] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and singing meaty stuff that's worthwhile.

[00:39:02] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[00:39:04] [SPEAKER_01]: That again, that teaches the faith,

[00:39:06] [SPEAKER_01]: that upholds you in that faith that is outside of yourself.

[00:39:15] [SPEAKER_01]: And it's outside of how you feel.

[00:39:19] [SPEAKER_01]: That isn't to say, it doesn't make you feel.

[00:39:25] [SPEAKER_01]: That isn't to say that feelings aren't important.

[00:39:29] [SPEAKER_01]: They are often a right expression of faith.

[00:39:34] [SPEAKER_01]: But they're not the measure.

[00:39:38] [SPEAKER_01]: The feels aren't the measure.

[00:39:40] [SPEAKER_01]: The word is the measure.

[00:39:42] [SPEAKER_01]: The oath, the covenant, the blood of Christ, that's the measure.

[00:39:47] [SPEAKER_01]: And that's what we're called the cling to.

[00:39:50] [SPEAKER_01]: Right?

[00:39:51] [SPEAKER_01]: So yeah, I rejoice in that.

[00:39:53] [SPEAKER_01]: I have absolutely no problem clinging to those things.

[00:40:00] [SPEAKER_01]: Even if I forget a whole bunch of other stuff.

[00:40:03] [SPEAKER_02]: And isn't it interesting?

[00:40:06] [SPEAKER_02]: To me, you remember some of this stuff word for word.

[00:40:13] [SPEAKER_02]: Other stuff passes by.

[00:40:15] [SPEAKER_02]: I can't remember what was going on this day.

[00:40:17] [SPEAKER_02]: But you remember word for word, the song.

[00:40:22] [SPEAKER_02]: What was sung?

[00:40:24] [SPEAKER_02]: How it was sung?

[00:40:26] [SPEAKER_02]: How it sounded.

[00:40:27] [SPEAKER_02]: How your body felt in that moment.

[00:40:32] [SPEAKER_02]: And you phrased it in such a way that I think is really important to acknowledge and for people to hear.

[00:40:39] [SPEAKER_02]: Is that song the church sang when we went acapella for a moment carried you.

[00:40:49] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[00:40:51] [SPEAKER_02]: And friends, that's what it's part of the reason you come to church.

[00:40:58] [SPEAKER_02]: Because you get Christ and you get his family.

[00:41:01] [SPEAKER_02]: And we are of course an imperfect family.

[00:41:05] [SPEAKER_02]: But we do bear one another's burdens.

[00:41:08] [SPEAKER_02]: And one of the ways we do that is we sing the Lord's song together.

[00:41:14] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, the song of the church.

[00:41:16] [SPEAKER_01]: And it's a grand thing.

[00:41:22] [SPEAKER_01]: It doesn't have to be in the face of death that you let the church carry you.

[00:41:27] [SPEAKER_02]: It's in the face of birth.

[00:41:28] [SPEAKER_02]: It's in the face of struggle.

[00:41:34] [SPEAKER_01]: Suffering which produces endurance, endurance which produces character, character which produces hope.

[00:41:42] [SPEAKER_01]: And a hope that does not put us to shame because our hope is in the glory of God and that's the resurrection promise.

[00:41:49] [SPEAKER_01]: It's unshakable.

[00:41:52] [SPEAKER_01]: Can you tell?

[00:41:53] [SPEAKER_02]: You're going to hear a little bit more about that.

[00:41:55] [SPEAKER_01]: I got a feeling.

[00:41:56] [SPEAKER_01]: I got a feeling.

[00:41:57] [SPEAKER_01]: As it were.

[00:41:58] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, because in a couple of weeks we have our back to school service and guess who's preaching.

[00:42:02] [SPEAKER_01]: And guess what I'm preaching about?

[00:42:04] [SPEAKER_01]: I wonder.

[00:42:06] [SPEAKER_01]: That'll be good.

[00:42:10] [SPEAKER_01]: You asked what I remember about the day.

[00:42:19] [SPEAKER_01]: Not much.

[00:42:23] [SPEAKER_01]: I remember the feel of dad's head.

[00:42:30] [SPEAKER_01]: His cold skin.

[00:42:32] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, kind of waxy hair.

[00:42:39] [SPEAKER_01]: Obviously, he'd been sweating.

[00:42:43] [SPEAKER_01]: I remember all three of us, my sister and my mom and I standing there waiting for the funeral home to come.

[00:42:58] [SPEAKER_01]: Standing together talking like dad was still with us.

[00:43:06] [SPEAKER_01]: Because of course.

[00:43:07] [SPEAKER_01]: Again, my dad may have died but he's not dead.

[00:43:15] [SPEAKER_01]: So it wasn't, we weren't necessarily talking about what dad would have wanted.

[00:43:22] [SPEAKER_01]: But talking about the things we know would.

[00:43:29] [SPEAKER_01]: A, support us and B, the next steps we had to take to make plans so that.

[00:43:37] [SPEAKER_01]: Dad, you can get what you want.

[00:43:39] [SPEAKER_01]: How are we going to get somebody to come and play the ongoing ambassadors for Christ theme song, I Am The Resurrection And The Life.

[00:43:51] [SPEAKER_01]: Who from OEFC are we going to be able to get to come to dad's funeral and do that?

[00:43:57] [SPEAKER_01]: Because that was one of the things dad wanted as I want I am the resurrection and the life at my funeral.

[00:44:06] [SPEAKER_01]: Okay.

[00:44:09] [SPEAKER_01]: Now I don't think he quite got it the way that he wanted it because we didn't sing the see the savior who hangs upon the tree.

[00:44:18] [SPEAKER_01]: Deskant that goes along with it with the OEFC version of I am the resurrection and the life for any of you OEFCers out there who happen to listen to this.

[00:44:29] [SPEAKER_01]: You'll know what I'm talking about.

[00:44:31] [SPEAKER_01]: But we sang it nonetheless.

[00:44:34] [SPEAKER_01]: And we sang abide with me as we walked out.

[00:44:42] [SPEAKER_01]: Hold out thy cross before my closing eyes.

[00:44:45] [SPEAKER_01]: Shine through the gloom.

[00:44:47] [SPEAKER_01]: Point me to the skies where heaven's morning breaks and earth's vain shadows flee.

[00:44:52] [SPEAKER_01]: What their vain shadows?

[00:44:55] [SPEAKER_01]: I mean all the suffering, all the temporary blech.

[00:44:59] [SPEAKER_01]: Their meaningless shadows.

[00:45:03] [SPEAKER_01]: They just point us forward.

[00:45:05] [SPEAKER_01]: They just prepare us for the life of the world to come.

[00:45:09] [SPEAKER_01]: O thou who changes not abide with me.

[00:45:13] [SPEAKER_01]: And that's the thing I remember from the funeral service as we left.

[00:45:19] [SPEAKER_01]: Being one of the Paul bearers.

[00:45:21] [SPEAKER_01]: Being the last one to have a hand on the casket as we close the vehicle to take dad to the graveside.

[00:45:29] [SPEAKER_01]: And saying you're home.

[00:45:32] [SPEAKER_01]: Being the last one to have a hand on the casket before we lowered him into the earth, into his final resting place in this temporary world.

[00:45:42] [SPEAKER_01]: You're home.

[00:45:47] [SPEAKER_02]: Thanks for joining us at Christ in All Things.

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[00:47:13] [SPEAKER_02]: All Post-Production Surplus supports Youth Ministry at St. Paul's. Thank you for your support.

[00:47:19] [SPEAKER_01]: Christ in All Things is a production of St. Paul's Lutheran Church, 210 East Pleasant Street in Oconama, W.W.

[00:47:25] [SPEAKER_01]: For more information about St. Paul's visit splco.org.

[00:47:30] [SPEAKER_01]: Email us at info at splco.org or the old fashioned way give us a call.

[00:47:36] [SPEAKER_01]: 262-567-5001.

[00:47:40] [SPEAKER_01]: Intro and Outro Music, setting by Joseph Hurl.

[00:47:43] [SPEAKER_01]: Copyright 1998, Concordia Publishing House, Used With Permission.